Author Topic: Using a Braid leader for Casting (Read 259469 times)

REEFMAN · « **Reply #100 on:** June 29, 2016, 12:02:45 PM »

Eish... had a look and I've got no idea of what he's trying to do. Seems way too complicated for my pea brain!
PR Knot is simple compared to this!

Trevour · « **Reply #101 on:** June 29, 2016, 12:41:37 PM »

I know - I read it a few times before understanding. basically you attach the end of the mainline about 750mm up the leader using a connection you can easily untie.The 750mm section is now running side by side to the mainline towards the reel. The reason for the initial knot is just to form a loop, enabling one to twist the leader and mainline together as in a bimini. After the twists the loop goes over a knee as usual, and the leader is walked back up the line as in a bimini, and the tag of the leader is tied off with whatever your favorite method is. You now have legs 2 coming out the knot as usual except one leg is the leader. Undo the original knot you tied with the mainline. This is effectively a tag end. Do a couple of half hitches with it around the leader just for security sake and cut it off.

Basically the leader ends up being the second leg of a normal bimini twisting down and walking back up the mainline. Its basically a pr knot. Using the leader rather than the mainline gives the knot more length than doing it the other way around and this is important. However doing a pr knot using the mainline will give a thinner knot. Either way the knot should be at least 50mm long.

REEFMAN · « **Reply #102 on:** June 29, 2016, 01:41:26 PM »

Think I'll stick to my bRaid stitch method if I'm at home and do the PR knot on the beach, or FG, or Bob Sands...

PatrickH · « **Reply #103 on:** June 29, 2016, 05:53:03 PM »

Ok Trevour, I am up for the challenge !! Will play around with it in the next few days

On another aspect, A few people seem to use Knot Sense or superglue. Does it make much of a difference apart from sticking my

fingers together and if so would one of the super glue gels not be better?

Ps You can see the guys have cabin fever.

Vandit · « **Reply #104 on:** June 29, 2016, 06:20:45 PM »

Tried the direct bimini, with significant diameter increase - PE 1.2 ~ 2 to PE 4+ my horrendous biminis slip and break due to dynamic loading. From my "pseudo" line tests, using JB hollow to hold the line, my FG's test 85%, my biminis slip at about ~65-70% (30 turns).

The thing with knots is however good you think you are at making them, my KNOT is not your KNOT is not Paulus's tested KNOT. To prevent infant mortality I always test my knots to at least 5kg's on my light line classes 15-30lb.

PatrickH · « **Reply #105 on:** June 29, 2016, 06:31:08 PM »

Please post the link for the Bimini Direct

Trevour · « **Reply #106 on:** June 29, 2016, 07:35:23 PM »

Also tied one. It becomes a bit fiddly, the remaining part of the leader tends to be all over the show. can imagine issues on the rocks. It's also a bit of a mission getting good tension in the bimini. Google paulusjustfishing for the site. I know some people use glues, Perhaps I would consider it to streamline a tag end, and but personally I think a well tied knot would ultimately be better, especially super glue that can be brittle. slipping biminis need more turns, and possibly more tension whilst tying

Psy · « **Reply #107 on:** June 30, 2016, 12:49:03 AM »

http://www.paulusjustfishing.com/4knotreview.htm

REEFMAN · « **Reply #108 on:** June 30, 2016, 06:55:40 AM »

Quote from: PatrickH on June 29, 2016, 05:53:03 PM

Ok Trevour, I am up for the challenge !! Will play around with it in the next few days

On another aspect, A few people seem to use Knot Sense or superglue. Does it make much of a difference apart from sticking my

fingers together and if so would one of the super glue gels not be better?

Ps You can see the guys have cabin fever.

I use Knot sense on most of my PR, FG knots and also on the tag ends of the Braid stitch. Sets best with a small UV penlight (it's tiny, about 8cm long) - look for the LOON OUTDOORS UV light in the Fly fishing section of your tackle shop - Result is a nice smooth and flexible join that runs through the guides nicely. Also helps keeping the mono tag exactly parallel with the mainline so it doesn't snag. It will definitely help your issue of the knot being noisy through the guides.
I find Superglue is too brittle and cracks develop.

Vandit · « **Reply #109 on:** June 30, 2016, 09:03:14 AM »

Quote from: PatrickH on June 29, 2016, 06:31:08 PM

Please post the link for the Bimini Direct

http://www.paulusjustfishing.com/images/BiminiTwistHeavyBraids.jpg

Vandit · « **Reply #110 on:** June 30, 2016, 09:08:50 AM »

Quote from: REEFMAN on June 30, 2016, 06:55:40 AM

Quote from: PatrickH on June 29, 2016, 05:53:03 PM
Ok Trevour, I am up for the challenge !! Will play around with it in the next few days

On another aspect, A few people seem to use Knot Sense or superglue. Does it make much of a difference apart from sticking my

fingers together and if so would one of the super glue gels not be better?

Ps You can see the guys have cabin fever.

I use Knot sense on most of my PR, FG knots and also on the tag ends of the Braid stitch. Sets best with a small UV penlight (it's tiny, about 8cm long) - look for the LOON OUTDOORS UV light in the Fly fishing section of your tackle shop - Result is a nice smooth and flexible join that runs through the guides nicely. Also helps keeping the mono tag exactly parallel with the mainline so it doesn't snag. It will definitely help your issue of the knot being noisy through the guides.
I find Superglue is too brittle and cracks develop.

Anyone tried this stuff instead of serving a hollow braid leader to mainline splice?

Vandit · « **Reply #111 on:** June 30, 2016, 09:18:01 AM »

Quote from: Trevour on June 29, 2016, 07:35:23 PM

Slipping biminis need more turns, and possibly more tension whilst tying.

My ham hands just can seem to knot a proper bimini. Tried increasing number of turns and making a massive loop to increase tension by using my knees. I just can't get them to test consistently.

REEFMAN · « **Reply #112 on:** June 30, 2016, 10:37:30 AM »

Roelof, come to the GP social on the 16th, we can go through a few techniques? Bimini, PR, FG, Bob sands etc...

PatrickH · « **Reply #113 on:** June 30, 2016, 08:48:35 PM »

Thanks Reefman.

Will try Knot Sense. Am still interested in trying super glue gel

PatrickH · « **Reply #114 on:** July 10, 2016, 04:20:51 PM »

I have found the FG knot for mainline braid to braid leader is a great knot. It is strong, quicker to tie than 2 biminis and a catspaw and passes easily through the guides.
It is the answer for me for spinning when you are unable to stitch lines together because of time and small diameter of braid.

glynnkent · « **Reply #115 on:** July 17, 2016, 11:14:52 AM »

Thanks for the great tutorial Reefz. It really has helped me a lot.

Just me 2c: In my experience, I feel that its imperative that you use the knot sense to finish off the end of the braid stitch. The eyes of my Amia really didn't enjoy the end of the stitch and it impact upon the distance i was getting. Before I had purchased the knot sense, I did a little half-hitch on the beach and cut the tag end very short which seemed to help pretty well as an interim solution.

On a somewhat unrelated note, I recently upgraded by braid to the new Gosen 21lb casting braid. It came at a hefty price. I've had it loaded on my Stradic 5000FJ for use on my 11ft XH Amia. On a few occasions while casting, the mainline braid wrapped around the first/second eye mid-cast; which is a rather harrowing experience.

Is this a result of the braid being too thin for the rod? Or am I doing something wrong in my casting? Would a longer/shorter braided leader assist in avoiding this situation? The rod has a recommended PE rating of 1.5 to 2.5 with the braid having a slightly lower PE rating of 1,2.
Cheers

Lofty · « **Reply #116 on:** July 17, 2016, 05:43:23 PM »

Have a read here regarding wind knots etc. : http://www.sportfishingmag.com/how-to-prevent-wind-knots-in-braid

Hope it sorts your guide wrapping problem out...

REEFMAN · « **Reply #117 on:** July 18, 2016, 06:57:29 AM »

And here... http://www.ultimateangling.co.za/index.php?topic=3596.msg41149#msg41149

Easiest way to get over this problem is to change the guides on your rod. No looking back.

Lenny · « **Reply #118 on:** July 18, 2016, 07:23:52 AM »

This is a interesting thread , I have not red it from the start .

I can only add UV KNOT sense are the way to go when it comes to glue .
The list of pros by far out weighs any other product .
When comparing uvks and superglue .

UV , are plyable , it stretches , and are soft and smooth , compare this to using superglue . NO COMPARISON .

I have made thousands of wind-ons with knot sense , some of them I have fished with for weeks , and the UV KS are still neat and shows very little damage.
We have also put them to the test extensively offshore , same story .
I will say it again and again , don't waist your time with super glue , yes some might find it works for the,

With the price of tackle and bait , why would you choose a product , that's not made for fishing to save 20 to 30 bucks .

Just my take on glues .

Steenie · « **Reply #119 on:** July 20, 2016, 02:25:06 PM »

Just some of my experiences with braid leaders since the beginning of 2016:

I have mastered the FG knot for my braid mainline to braid leader connection and treat the knot with UV knot sense. It travels beautifully through the KR concept guides that Fishatic has put onto my Assassin Sierra rod. The knot strength is phenomenal.

A big learning curve was pairing my braid mainline with the correct thickness braid leader. I initially tried to pair my PE1.5 (25 lb) Gosen casting braid that does not absorb water (due to teflon coating) with a 5 meter section of PE4 braid leader (50 lb JDB 8-weave). This turned out to be way too big a stepup! The braid leader was too heavy, and got even heavier once it absorbed water, and this caused a traffic jam (with guide wrapping) in the guides during the cast. This happened infrequent, but enough times to place doubt in your mind with every cast. I had a couple of snapoffs losing lures in the process. Interestingly, the specific KR concept guides on my rod did not prevent this from happening. I ended up using shorter and shorter lengths of the PE4 braid leader (as short as 3. 5 meter) to try and combat the problem, but it did not work. The only solution was to lower the PE rating of the braid leader. Stepping down to a PE2.5 (35 lb) leader solved my problem completely! I still need to see if I can get away with a PE3 leader. Despite these intial problems I find the use of braid leaders extremely advantageous and will certainly not go back to using PE1.5 setups without them.