SEINE NETTERS AND CATCHERS

[jb2]

They knew exactly what they were catching.

Hi Robin
Obviously they did. There is a lot more to the story though.

[Lenny]

You see JB2 , thats the type of Statement , that leaves ,Doubt into my mind , and to others . As what your Agenda is , to me , and most others[that find it worth it to respond on this thread ] its plain ans simple.
1 . They knew it was White Steenbrass .
2 They knew there are not allowed to 'harvest them , OR to sell them '
3. giving DAFF persons on site fish IS a Bribe , no matter how you try to Gloss the story !
4. I dont want to heard about Sectors , and Permits , and taking food from their mouths [or Martins inshore Hake Quotas whoo haa or the colour of Ray halls Guides  ]
5. So whats ' more to the story '?
6. The only possible reason is that they get away with it , and have been getting away with this for years !
7. this is wrong however way you see it or like in your case try to put a 'gloss' on the crime , dont put a gloss on a dirty disgusting deed.
8. We have a right to those fish , hell Rec Fishers basicly have more rights than the netters , we can still keep a Steenbras.
Leads me to my next point , and final point , You Jb 2 seem to have a lot of info , and are in the industry , like many others , and like many members we would like to unite , to get something done about this , you have to be really naive to say that these actions are fine , as its not one or 2 incidents , this is how they roll , rape, pilage and plunder .The owners of these permits , are FAT , they have lots of kids , and generally does not look like they are hungry , they also have the latest phones plastered to their ears during the trek , VOL airtime .


I have no time for people that destroy nature , litter and does not seem to think for the future , it takes one person out of a hundred to stuff up the other 99's conservasion/ C&R efforts . I would love to see these people in jail !

[CLS]

If what they are doing is illegal then why are they not arrested???, there is photo graphic proof ??. It's insane.

[jb2]

You see JB2 , thats the type of Statement , that leaves ,Doubt into my mind , and to others . As what your Agenda is , to me , and most others[that find it worth it to respond on this thread ] its plain ans simple.
1 . They knew it was White Steenbrass .
2 They knew there are not allowed to 'harvest them , OR to sell them '
3. giving DAFF persons on site fish IS a Bribe , no matter how you try to Gloss the story !
4. I dont want to heard about Sectors , and Permits , and taking food from their mouths [or Martins inshore Hake Quotas whoo haa or the colour of Ray halls Guides  ]
5. So whats ' more to the story '?
6. The only possible reason is that they get away with it , and have been getting away with this for years !
7. this is wrong however way you see it or like in your case try to put a 'gloss' on the crime , dont put a gloss on a dirty disgusting deed.
8. We have a right to those fish , hell Rec Fishers basicly have more rights than the netters , we can still keep a Steenbras.
Leads me to my next point , and final point , You Jb 2 seem to have a lot of info , and are in the industry , like many others , and like many members we would like to unite , to get something done about this , you have to be really naive to say that these actions are fine , as its not one or 2 incidents , this is how they roll , rape, pilage and plunder .The owners of these permits , are FAT , they have lots of kids , and generally does not look like they are hungry , they also have the latest phones plastered to their ears during the trek , VOL airtime .


I have no time for people that destroy nature , litter and does not seem to think for the future , it takes one person out of a hundred to stuff up the other 99's conservasion/ C&R efforts . I would love to see these people in jail !

Hi
 
I was unclear.
When I said that there was more to it, I meant that it is worse than people think!

[RobinF]

I'm going to follow up with DAFF regarding this incident when I am back in SA. Either they must prosecute or set a precedence for catching and keeping White Steenbras. (i.e. the Trekker gets prosecuted or they allow the wholesale slaughter of this protected species. The fact is that if they do nothing, they cannot touch anyone else). There is no grey area. It's either or.

I'm not one for open ended statements that leave everyone scratching their heads, so as I get info, I will post it.

[jb2]

I'm going to follow up with DAFF regarding this incident when I am back in SA. Either they must prosecute or set a precedence for catching and keeping White Steenbras. (i.e. the Trekker gets prosecuted or they allow the wholesale slaughter of this protected species. The fact is that if they do nothing, they cannot touch anyone else). There is no grey area. It's either or.

I'm not one for open ended statements that leave everyone scratching their heads, so as I get info, I will post it.

Hi Robin
We are way ahead of you.
Organised angling will let us know the details of the car.
As soon as I have some specs on the boat owner I will let you know.
Anglers have been in touch with DAFF, Sanparks and a couple of others.
The photos of the guy in the uniform appear to be of  DAFF official but I can't place the white shirt.
Will keep you posted.

[Lenny]

I'm going to follow up with DAFF regarding this incident when I am back in SA. Either they must prosecute or set a precedence for catching and keeping White Steenbras. (i.e. the Trekker gets prosecuted or they allow the wholesale slaughter of this protected species. The fact is that if they do nothing, they cannot touch anyone else). There is no grey area. It's either or.

I'm not one for open ended statements that leave everyone scratching their heads, so as I get info, I will post it.

Hi Robin
We are way ahead of you.
Organised angling will let us know the details of the car.
As soon as I have some specs on the boat owner I will let you know.
Anglers have been in touch with DAFF, Sanparks and a couple of others.
The photos of the guy in the uniform appear to be of  DAFF official but I can't place the white shirt.
Will keep you posted.

ATLAST , it seems we gettin our  together and sticking together !!!to stop these things !

[jb2]

I'm going to follow up with DAFF regarding this incident when I am back in SA. Either they must prosecute or set a precedence for catching and keeping White Steenbras. (i.e. the Trekker gets prosecuted or they allow the wholesale slaughter of this protected species. The fact is that if they do nothing, they cannot touch anyone else). There is no grey area. It's either or.

I'm not one for open ended statements that leave everyone scratching their heads, so as I get info, I will post it.

Hi Robin
We are way ahead of you.
Organised angling will let us know the details of the car.
As soon as I have some specs on the boat owner I will let you know.
Anglers have been in touch with DAFF, Sanparks and a couple of others.
The photos of the guy in the uniform appear to be of  DAFF official but I can't place the white shirt.
Will keep you posted.

ATLAST , it seems we gettin our  together and sticking together !!!to stop these things !

Hi Lenny
There is a lot that happens behind the scenes. Not much of it is discussed.
It is usually done with little fanfare and through a few emails bouncing around.
 

[RobinF]

Don't care who's ahead of who, I am still going to follow up myself. (Hopefully when I get back to SA there will be a positive posting regarding this illegal catch). 

[jb2]

Don't care who's ahead of who, I am still going to follow up myself. (Hopefully when I get back to SA there will be a positive posting regarding this illegal catch).

Hi Robin
It is not a race. We can all follow up on everything. I simply wanted to explain that things are progressing in Cape Town.
The Macassar trek is headed for the high jump.
I will keep you posted. I sometimes hear stuff.

[jb2]

Don't care who's ahead of who, I am still going to follow up myself. (Hopefully when I get back to SA there will be a positive posting regarding this illegal catch).

Hi Robin
I said that I would try to keep you up to speed so here goes.
From the newspaper articles Fisheries appears to be taking it quite seriously.
They want to know if there were inspectors there. They have gone through the DAFF vehicle tracking device to see if it was at Macassar.
The usual recreational fishing network is grinding away getting evidence to authorities in a pretty steady but low key way.
If you need any other info please drop me a line.

[CLS]

Good news and thanks for keeping us updated.

[RobinF]

At this stage DAFF reckon that according to Tracker, that no DAFF vehicles were on that site. When asked if they were advised that the trek was taking place, they declined to comment.....It's ok, the truth will come out.

In my opinion (and it is only my opinion) they knew about it, knew what species were being targeted and turned a blind eye....and now they are falling over themselves.

What this has done is opened up the first major battlefront. DAFF clearly have it in their wallets or pockets or agendas to make sure these guys all carry on and possibly add to the pot a few more. I always said this situation is going to cut itself and here it starts. (Add a few more and their will be turf wars.)

So on the Strandfontein & Macassar side this is in the last 12 months:

Trek #1 - Arendse: We have photo's of one huge load of undersized Cob with another Bakkie (not from the trek netter, but assisting him) taking the undersized Cob - the undersized Cob were never given to DAFF.
Trek # 2 - Naartjie: (This is older than 12 months I think, but is on the court roll) Over 1000 undersized Cob seized and now a court case pending.
Trek # 3 - Macassar Trek: Huge haul of protected White Steenbras.

Then there's the clown at Vetche's Pier in Kzn with a looooooong history of raping the fish stocks and taking species that he is not allowed to take.

This keeps happening again and again.

Is it just me or is there a bloody trend here. People will say that the battle must be fought in the government offices and at the DAFF meetings....no people. These guys have their own agendas.....this is a fight that must be fought on OUR terms not theirs. Every load of photo's that are put out there add to the growing evidence and I tell you this, it is only time before Carte Blanche or the likes start asking questions. These guys are giving us all the ammo we need. Let the hard questions get asked to the DAFF Seniors when we have more evidence and see what they say. They are going to look like a bunch of absolute monkeys. There are many key players in the marine conservation industry already involved in this, I guess it's like waiting for the volcano to blow. 

The only issue is that our marine resources are the price for that wait.

It shows a lot about DAFF when they need the public to police these waters like this. This latest Macasser trek should have crapped when they saw what they had and opened the net. What they did do is show a flagrant disregard for the law and that shows me that they have done this lots before and fear no law. In other words, they know someone in DAFF that will protect them.

[jb2]

At this stage DAFF reckon that according to Tracker, that no DAFF vehicles were on that site. When asked if they were advised that the trek was taking place, they declined to comment.....It's ok, the truth will come out.

In my opinion (and it is only my opinion) they knew about it, knew what species were being targeted and turned a blind eye....and now they are falling over themselves.

What this has done is opened up the first major battlefront. DAFF clearly have it in their wallets or pockets or agendas to make sure these guys all carry on and possibly add to the pot a few more. I always said this situation is going to cut itself and here it starts. (Add a few more and their will be turf wars.)

So on the Strandfontein & Macassar side this is in the last 12 months:

Trek #1 - Arendse: We have photo's of one huge load of undersized Cob with another Bakkie (not from the trek netter, but assisting him) taking the undersized Cob - the undersized Cob were never given to DAFF.
Trek # 2 - Naartjie: (This is older than 12 months I think, but is on the court roll) Over 1000 undersized Cob seized and now a court case pending.
Trek # 3 - Macassar Trek: Huge haul of protected White Steenbras.

Then there's the clown at Vetche's Pier in Kzn with a looooooong history of raping the fish stocks and taking species that he is not allowed to take.

This keeps happening again and again.

Is it just me or is there a bloody trend here. People will say that the battle must be fought in the government offices and at the DAFF meetings....no people. These guys have their own agendas.....this is a fight that must be fought on OUR terms not theirs. Every load of photo's that are put out there add to the growing evidence and I tell you this, it is only time before Carte Blanche or the likes start asking questions. These guys are giving us all the ammo we need. Let the hard questions get asked to the DAFF Seniors when we have more evidence and see what they say. They are going to look like a bunch of absolute monkeys. There are many key players in the marine conservation industry already involved in this, I guess it's like waiting for the volcano to blow. 

The only issue is that our marine resources are the price for that wait.

It shows a lot about DAFF when they need the public to police these waters like this. This latest Macasser trek should have crapped when they saw what they had and opened the net. What they did do is show a flagrant disregard for the law and that shows me that they have done this lots before and fear no law. In other words, they know someone in DAFF that will protect them.

Hi Robin
Much of what you say has little connection to reality. It is so hard to respond to some of the stuff that you say since it is just weird.
A discussion taking place on another forum suggests it might have been a security guard. The white shirt is not DAFF uniform.
You are mixing up the two undersize kob stories with the Arendses.
The big load was when Osbourne the inspector was there. Remember the other time  you told that story about Aziz taking the fish to Gauteng. You got upset when I asked you to stick to the truth but you later said that the fish did not go to Gauteng.
When Osbourne loaded the Arendse fish onto his bakkie he was accepting it in terms of the permit conditions. There is no offence committed. There is no collusion or assistance.
There is no reason to spice up a story. Let's all stick to the truth.
The Macassar story is spicy enough. 
You have no insight into the current  dynamics inside DAFF.
Take it easy.
Shame the Devil and tell the truth.

[jb2]

At this stage DAFF reckon that according to Tracker, that no DAFF vehicles were on that site. When asked if they were advised that the trek was taking place, they declined to comment.....It's ok, the truth will come out.

In my opinion (and it is only my opinion) they knew about it, knew what species were being targeted and turned a blind eye....and now they are falling over themselves.

What this has done is opened up the first major battlefront. DAFF clearly have it in their wallets or pockets or agendas to make sure these guys all carry on and possibly add to the pot a few more. I always said this situation is going to cut itself and here it starts. (Add a few more and their will be turf wars.)

So on the Strandfontein & Macassar side this is in the last 12 months:

Trek #1 - Arendse: We have photo's of one huge load of undersized Cob with another Bakkie (not from the trek netter, but assisting him) taking the undersized Cob - the undersized Cob were never given to DAFF.
Trek # 2 - Naartjie: (This is older than 12 months I think, but is on the court roll) Over 1000 undersized Cob seized and now a court case pending.
Trek # 3 - Macassar Trek: Huge haul of protected White Steenbras.

Then there's the clown at Vetche's Pier in Kzn with a looooooong history of raping the fish stocks and taking species that he is not allowed to take.

This keeps happening again and again.

Is it just me or is there a bloody trend here. People will say that the battle must be fought in the government offices and at the DAFF meetings....no people. These guys have their own agendas.....this is a fight that must be fought on OUR terms not theirs. Every load of photo's that are put out there add to the growing evidence and I tell you this, it is only time before Carte Blanche or the likes start asking questions. These guys are giving us all the ammo we need. Let the hard questions get asked to the DAFF Seniors when we have more evidence and see what they say. They are going to look like a bunch of absolute monkeys. There are many key players in the marine conservation industry already involved in this, I guess it's like waiting for the volcano to blow. 

The only issue is that our marine resources are the price for that wait.

It shows a lot about DAFF when they need the public to police these waters like this. This latest Macasser trek should have crapped when they saw what they had and opened the net. What they did do is show a flagrant disregard for the law and that shows me that they have done this lots before and fear no law. In other words, they know someone in DAFF that will protect them.

Hi Robin
 
Confirmation just in on Sealine. Those guys are security guards and not DAFF.
The white sleeves were bugging me. DAFF have full khaki.
Please don't let the facts get in the way of a good conspiracy theory though.
 

[RobinF]

 
Hi Robin
Much of what you say has little connection to reality. It is so hard to respond to some of the stuff that you say since it is just weird.
A discussion taking place on another forum suggests it might have been a security guard. The white shirt is not DAFF uniform.
You are mixing up the two undersize kob stories with the Arendses.
The big load was when Osbourne the inspector was there. Remember the other time  you told that story about Aziz taking the fish to Gauteng. You got upset when I asked you to stick to the truth but you later said that the fish did not go to Gauteng.
When Osbourne loaded the Arendse fish onto his bakkie he was accepting it in terms of the permit conditions. There is no offence committed. There is no collusion or assistance.
There is no reason to spice up a story. Let's all stick to the truth.
The Macassar story is spicy enough. 
You have no insight into the current  dynamics inside DAFF.
Take it easy.
Shame the Devil and tell the truth.




Seems I hit a nerve. You friends are raping the ocean, face up to it.

Stop trying to discredit me, I never lied and I never contradicted myself.

Maybe you should do as the forum admin has asked you a number of times and stop addressing individuals and address the forum rather.

I also take exception you you outright statement that I have no insight into the current dynamics inside DAFF...How dare you?

You need to face what your buddies are doing...

[2bar.boost]

JB2 You seem to be abit of a troll. No offence, se' ma net 

[RobinF]

Something bothering me is how on earth does someone know (apparently for a fact) that there is no assistance or collusion between the trek netters and DAFF? Even if it is one official. Clearly someone knows for a fact that the entire DAFF is clean....and I am wierd.

[jb2]

 
Hi Robin
Much of what you say has little connection to reality. It is so hard to respond to some of the stuff that you say since it is just weird.
A discussion taking place on another forum suggests it might have been a security guard. The white shirt is not DAFF uniform.
You are mixing up the two undersize kob stories with the Arendses.
The big load was when Osbourne the inspector was there. Remember the other time  you told that story about Aziz taking the fish to Gauteng. You got upset when I asked you to stick to the truth but you later said that the fish did not go to Gauteng.
When Osbourne loaded the Arendse fish onto his bakkie he was accepting it in terms of the permit conditions. There is no offence committed. There is no collusion or assistance.
There is no reason to spice up a story. Let's all stick to the truth.
The Macassar story is spicy enough. 
You have no insight into the current  dynamics inside DAFF.
Take it easy.
Shame the Devil and tell the truth.




Seems I hit a nerve. You friends are raping the ocean, face up to it.

Stop trying to discredit me, I never lied and I never contradicted myself.

Maybe you should do as the forum admin has asked you a number of times and stop addressing individuals and address the forum rather.

I also take exception you you outright statement that I have no insight into the current dynamics inside DAFF...How dare you?

You need to face what your buddies are doing...

Hi Robin
I have never met the guys who trek at Macassar but let's go through some of the stuff that you say.
I also take exception you  outright statement that I have no insight into the current dynamics inside DAFF...How dare you?

Since around 1999 I have been working in fisheries policy. It is a relatively short time given the long institutional memory that is required but I can quite easily "dare" to make the inference that you have little contact with DAFF based on the contents of your posts.
Barely a few months  ago I sent you an email to help you work out which trekker has which bakkie and which boat.
As always Robin please feel free to explain to me how you have gained some insight.

Stop trying to discredit me, I never lied and I never contradicted myself
But Robin we all thought that there were DAFF officials at the Macassar trek and now it seems that they were security guards. I have certainly revised my opinion when confronted with the real facts. There is no shame in saying that you had relied on mistaken information.
 
Maybe you should do as the forum admin has asked you a number of times and stop addressing individuals and address the forum rather.
I understand that one should write to the forum as a whole and when the forum as a whole starts belting out the stuff that you do then I would be more inclined to do so.
 It would be a bit strange if I started saying "Would you all get a grip and try to get the facts and take it easy with the trippy conspiracy stuff!".
Let me know your thoughts on the photo.
 
DAFF or security? I a still stuck on that white shirt. Shouldn't it be Khaki.

[RobinF]

I have no inclination to level with you or answer your silly questions. Just accept that your clients are raping our marine resources.

If you want to prove how big 'it' is, get a magnifying glass or leave the rubbish off Ultimate Angling.