Author Topic: Suzuki Outboard - NO COMPRESSION ON 3 CYLINDERS - 900h - 5 years old (Read 13829 times)

rcoliveira84 · « **on:** April 01, 2019, 11:44:47 AM »

Hi Guys,
Just wanted to know your opinion about what happened to my Suzuki Engines last week.

How can a 5year old(one owner), 900h engine have no compression on the 3 cylinders. Using it not commercially but as a weekend boat? When all the services where made in time and the engines were really well taken care of.

Here a video with a more detailed explanation of what happened. Includes pictures of the engines and videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anNYTuH1hSU

Please let me know if you have ever heard of new engines doing this and your opinions and questions.
Thanks so much
Regards Ricky

HooknCook · « **Reply #1 on:** April 01, 2019, 01:25:38 PM »

Are you 100% sure its No compression or fuel issue?? I have had fuel issue before at Inhaca and so has 2 mates, all with Suzuki’s, these engines are very clever and dont let you damage them.

rcoliveira84 · « **Reply #2 on:** April 01, 2019, 02:14:29 PM »

Quote from: HooknCook on April 01, 2019, 01:25:38 PM

Are you 100% sure its No compression or fuel issue?? I have had fuel issue before at Inhaca and so has 2 mates, all with Suzuki’s, these engines are very clever and dont let you damage them.

Hi HooknCook
Yeah, we sure its no compression on the cylinders, it has been double checked.
We even thought it was carbonisation of the valves due to high trolling hours, but after 24hours with a compression stabiliser. We did another test and all 3 cylinders still had no compression.

The PowerHead are with Suzuki in Durban. Just waiting for their assessment.

Regards
Ricky

HooknCook · « **Reply #3 on:** April 01, 2019, 02:25:26 PM »

And on both Engines?

rcoliveira84 · « **Reply #4 on:** April 01, 2019, 02:34:25 PM »

The other engine has one cylinder with lower compression then the other 2 cylinders. But not as low as the other engine.
But I sent the 2 Powerheads to check that cylinder as well

FishStyx · « **Reply #5 on:** April 01, 2019, 03:34:09 PM »

FWIW... Not sure of the relevance here but a few years ago I became very nervous of Moz Diesel. My Isuzu bakkie (non turbo) was 80 odd thousand ks old when I took a drive from the South up till close to Beira and then back and through Giriyondo. By the time I got home, the bakkie was struggling quite a bit, so I took it off to a diesel specialist and he tested my injectors... They were toast. They had worn out on the trip. I assume that there was a reasonable amount of abrasive in one or two tanks of fuel... I had a pretty hefty replacement cost.

rcoliveira84 · « **Reply #6 on:** April 01, 2019, 04:24:18 PM »

Quote from: HooknCook on April 01, 2019, 02:25:26 PM

And on both Engines?

Check attached file for compression test.
1,2,3 is engine one.5,6,7 is engine two.

Rory mundy · « **Reply #7 on:** April 01, 2019, 09:22:14 PM »

Poor fuel causing oil dilution and rings have worn badly

dugong · « **Reply #8 on:** April 02, 2019, 08:59:11 AM »

Do you have filters/watertraps, what is the condition of the filters, inboard tanks??
When and if you do the motors have the exhaust jackets checked, those Suzuki 4's had a problem where they rotted out, it was a very expensive fix but maybe its been rectified with the later models?

rcoliveira84 · « **Reply #9 on:** April 02, 2019, 09:19:32 AM »

Quote from: Rory mundy on April 01, 2019, 09:22:14 PM

Poor fuel causing oil dilution and rings have worn badly

If it was rings wouldn't It use up oil. Oil level never changed. And it looked clean.

rcoliveira84 · « **Reply #10 on:** April 02, 2019, 09:32:23 AM »

Quote from: dugong on April 02, 2019, 08:59:11 AM

Do you have filters/watertraps, what is the condition of the filters, inboard tanks??
When and if you do the motors have the exhaust jackets checked, those Suzuki 4's had a problem where they rotted out, it was a very expensive fix but maybe its been rectified with the later models?

Yeah I have this Yamaha Fuel Filter and Water separator. Never had to remove any water from it.
I am very careful where I get my fuel and its right in front of the marina. Where all the boats get their fuel. Theres no one else around with similar problems.
Never heard of that exhaust problem, but i'll check that as well. Do you reckon this could have anything to do with the compression?

dugong · « **Reply #11 on:** April 02, 2019, 09:37:48 AM »

I really don't know but in a car if something like the egr valve leaks then water gets past which could stuff things up pretty badly??
It has happened to a few Ford Rangers, one here at work.

Johnny Earing · « **Reply #12 on:** April 02, 2019, 10:20:34 AM »

Could be burnt valves or worn rings both of which can be due to bad fuel.
A cylinder head leakage test will confirm/eliminate burnt valves/valve seats.

Bad fuel will damage injectors and affect spray patterns and can cause over fuelling or under fuelling. Over fuelling will wash bores, and create oil dilution. and cause a loss of compression. Under fuelling will cause increased exhaust temperature resulting in burnt valves / damaged seats.

Did the motor/motors overheat at any time?

Did you ever have 1 bad batch of fuel?

HooknCook · « **Reply #13 on:** April 02, 2019, 11:51:41 AM »

Hi Rico, im convinced fuel has caused it. I fish a lot at Inhaca, 70% of my time is there. I have the Yamaha Water traps and so does my mate. It goes past this. He has just had a issue where his engine was very flat when sudden acceleration was required. After going thru the whole fuel system, he observed that the little fuel filter at the Injection rail/Vapour seperator was totally clogged up. It was black. I had a situation where I lost power on my right engine and also had to limp back to Inhaca with it in Limp mode. Bad fuel had gotten past the Water seperator. What I am told and cant verify, is that a lot of guys buy Fuel that is expired/old then the flashpoint has decreased so in order to increase this, they add Alcohol i believe to increase the flash point. When I looked at my Water Seperator the ring wasnt floating at all, but the colour was opaque/milky.

While your engine is stripped, examine all the fuel filters. My mates engine had 900hrs on and apparently Suzuki changes that filter at 1000hrs only. Im not very technical so my terminology may be slightly out!

rcoliveira84 · « **Reply #14 on:** April 02, 2019, 11:52:57 AM »

Quote from: Johnny Earing on April 02, 2019, 10:20:34 AM

Could be burnt valves or worn rings both of which can be due to bad fuel.
A cylinder head leakage test will confirm/eliminate burnt valves/valve seats.

Bad fuel will damage injectors and affect spray patterns and can cause over fuelling or under fuelling. Over fuelling will wash bores, and create oil dilution. and cause a loss of compression. Under fuelling will cause increased exhaust temperature resulting in burnt valves / damaged seats.

Did the motor/motors overheat at any time?

Did you ever have 1 bad batch of fuel?

Never had a bad batch of fuel.
That I remember once, when flushing the engines and water pressure wasn't enough. But turned off straight away.

rcoliveira84 · « **Reply #15 on:** April 02, 2019, 11:59:57 AM »

Quote from: HooknCook on April 02, 2019, 11:51:41 AM

Hi Rico, im convinced fuel has caused it. I fish a lot at Inhaca, 70% of my time is there. I have the Yamaha Water traps and so does my mate. It goes past this. He has just had a issue where his engine was very flat when sudden acceleration was required. After going thru the whole fuel system, he observed that the little fuel filter at the Injection rail/Vapour seperator was totally clogged up. It was black. I had a situation where I lost power on my right engine and also had to limp back to Inhaca with it in Limp mode. Bad fuel had gotten past the Water seperator. What I am told and cant verify, is that a lot of guys buy Fuel that is expired/old then the flashpoint has decreased so in order to increase this, they add Alcohol i believe to increase the flash point. When I looked at my Water Seperator the ring wasnt floating at all, but the colour was opaque/milky.

While your engine is stripped, examine all the fuel filters. My mates engine had 900hrs on and apparently Suzuki changes that filter at 1000hrs only. Im not very technical so my terminology may be slightly out!

Yeah, fuel must be the most probable cause for sure.
I'll have a look at my fuel line.
The only thing that bothers me is that all the other engines are going thru the exact same fuel as me. And no one else has a similar problem at least in such new engines. Mostly Yamaha doing as many hours as me in the club.

marctrevenen · « **Reply #16 on:** April 02, 2019, 01:13:24 PM »

The attached picture shows the residue, sludge in the high pressure pumps filter after 400hrs in a new Yamaha 225Hp, the recommendation from Yamaha is to change the filter after 1000hrs, all the other filters were clean as they had been replaced when serviced. We suspect this was caused by the fuel used when we visited Inhaca Island and utilised fuel stored there. The error experienced was that the motor would run fine for a while then after a few hours would lose revs and would not rev above 1800 rpm, anything higher the engine backfired through fuel starvation, it was not a compression loss problem and the diagnostics on the motor did not pick up any error either.

rcoliveira84 · « **Reply #17 on:** April 02, 2019, 03:22:52 PM »

Quote from: marctrevenen on April 02, 2019, 01:13:24 PM

The attached picture shows the residue, sludge in the high pressure pumps filter after 400hrs in a new Yamaha 225Hp, the recommendation from Yamaha is to change the filter after 1000hrs, all the other filters were clean as they had been replaced when serviced. We suspect this was caused by the fuel used when we visited Inhaca Island and utilised fuel stored there. The error experienced was that the motor would run fine for a while then after a few hours would lose revs and would not rev above 1800 rpm, anything higher the engine backfired through fuel starvation, it was not a compression loss problem and the diagnostics on the motor did not pick up any error either.

Thats crazy hey.
But buying fuel in funny places in Moz is a no no. I try being as careful as possible. When in inhaca I prefer to come back to maputo to refuel then buying it there.

HooknCook · « **Reply #18 on:** April 02, 2019, 04:00:36 PM »

This is exactly what we have picked up at inhaca on our Engines. I mostly buy fuel in Maputo and some at Inhaca, but I think this problem is on the quality of Fuel in general in Moz perhaps.

Rory mundy · « **Reply #19 on:** April 02, 2019, 05:03:07 PM »

Quote from: marctrevenen on April 02, 2019, 01:13:24 PM

The attached picture shows the residue, sludge in the high pressure pumps filter after 400hrs in a new Yamaha 225Hp, the recommendation from Yamaha is to change the filter after 1000hrs, all the other filters were clean as they had been replaced when serviced. We suspect this was caused by the fuel used when we visited Inhaca Island and utilised fuel stored there. The error experienced was that the motor would run fine for a while then after a few hours would lose revs and would not rev above 1800 rpm, anything higher the engine backfired through fuel starvation, it was not a compression loss problem and the diagnostics on the motor did not pick up any error either.

more worring is you have 2x 225s on a 21 yeld